New Glow Plugs ?

[Roadkill]

The Mondeo's been starting a bit rough lately and within the last couple of days starts really lumpy when warm and / or needs the key turned over for a good couple of seconds to get her going.

It feels like she's starting on two or three when she does it.

Everything else is spot on.  She goes well, picks up very nicely and economy's better than ever so I'm guessing the injectors are O.K.

What's peoples thoughts ?

This is my first diesel and they're not my forte.

A full set of plugs are £35 so I was thinking of doing an oil / filter change at the same time . . . she'll be at 180,000 miles soon.

[Andy]

Can't see no harm!

When I had mine changed in the old Mondie, it made a huge difference to the warm up. As in for the first mile or so it sounded like a bag of nails but once changed it sounded much better and would idle as if warm.

To be honest you shouldn't be having too many difficulties in this weather, it's winter that glow plug issues really show up.

If you haven't changed a set before it might be worth just having a look at how to go about getting them out. I tried to do mine but the solid injector lines meant I couldn't get to the fuel pump end ones. Had to get those done by a garage. Also if they haven't been changed, or if they've seen a lot of miles, expect them to be well and truly cruded in there. A bit of patients and a bit of back and forth should ease them out though.

[Andy]

Oh yeah, and like spark plugs, don't buy the cheapest pair. Seeing as they last a good few years they're worth the expense. I believe 'Denso' and Bocshe are the best, cheap nasty ones will have died by the winter!

[art b]

as a rule glow plugs only operate at low temps..below  8 deg

if there in operation, the light on the dash will be on,

mine dont operate in this warm weather,ie no dash light...

[Roadkill]

I've never noticed a dashlight at all - even in winter !

Now I'm worried.

[Roadkill]

Hmm, found a few mentions of low fuel pressure being a problem when warm/hot.

Points to air getting in either by a failed injector or fuel filter.

Could also be a failing fuel pump.

Think I'll ignore it for now, see if it fixes itself.

[Cunning Plan]

Quoting: Roadkill

180,000 miles soon

Wow nice!

Quoting: art b

as a rule glow plugs only operate at low temps..below 8 deg

if there in operation, the light on the dash will be on,

It could also be sensors - they are everywhere. CPS I think is a typical one.

[Roadkill]

Quoting: Cunning Plan

CPS I think is a typical one

Nah - that'd stop it starting at all - wouldn't it ?

[Andy]

Bah, my old one would fired glow plugs every start! Even our van at work a 54reg VW Caddy has the glow plug symbol lit every time you start it.

I don't know much about the TDCi engine but the TD was prone to fuel starvation when sat for a while due to various air leaks in the spill over pipes and connectors. I never got around to replacing them all but one guy on MEG put a non return valve on the main fuel pipe. That seemed to cure his woes of a leaky fuel system.

You should have a dash symbol, looks like a light bulb filiment and should glow orange or yellow.

Depending on what fuel filter and system you have, I can advise against taking it apart in the engine bay to change. Lost a half a litre all over my gearbox, cleaned it up a champ but ever so fiddily to do!

[Roadkill]

Quoting: Andy

prone to fuel starvation when sat for a while

Mine definately isn't allowed to sit for any period of time !

[F Body]

Quoting: art b

as a rule glow plugs only operate at low temps..below 8 deg

if there in operation, the light on the dash will be on,

Not so on modern diesels

They come on 100% for starting and then progressively step down to 75%, 50% and then 25% as the engine warms.

The Panda was starting fine but then running like a dog until it was warm, the garage couldn't find any fault codes and reflashed the ECU without it fixing the problem.
Days MK suggested that the glow plug control unit was to blame, i.e it worked to start with and then missed the next steps down

Long story short, I took a £117 punt and it fixed the problem

[Andy]

Quoting: F Body

They come on 100% for starting and then progressively step down to 75%, 50% and then 25% as the engine warms.

Ok, never heard that before. I believed they came on with the ignition, wait for the light to go out, then crank over the engine. Once the light had gone out, the glow plugs were effectively off, but due to the red hot lump of copper they use, still heating the cylinder (in my case fuel injection area).

[Roadkill]

Now I'm just confused.

[F Body]

Quoting: Roadkill

Now I'm just confused.

Mondeo Forum  I'm sure they'll be a cheap skate fix out there

[art b]

Quoting: F Body

Long story short, I took a £117 punt and it fixed the problem

cant see RK spendin that much...

[Andy]

Quoting: F Body

Mondeo Forum

MEG or Mondeo Enthusiasts Group (sigh) has since changed to TalkFord.com and still has a lot of useful information on it. If you are concerned then have a look through the MK3 Diesel section. It'll probably be nothing to complicated, but doing a full service on it will rule out the basics of a clogged air or fuel filter. The glow plugs really show their age come winter though.

My knowledge all comes from the old TD engine which was replaced by the TDDi and then the more powerful 1.8 and 2.0 TDCi. The later were completely different in the fuelling system.

[Incursus]

Did sound rather rough when you started it last night.

Strange tapping/clicking sound as you turned it over... Almost like a starter motor on a low battery.

[Roadkill]

Definately a warm / hot starting problem as it was fine this morning.

Had a look at the fuel rail and lines etc . . . all look like new almost.

[Andy]

Quoting: Incursus

Strange tapping/clicking sound as you turned it over... Almost like a starter motor on a low battery.

Don't say things like that... Could be the dreaded DMF!

Only struggles when warm? Our Caddy does too. Do you let all the idiot lights go out before cranking?

[Roadkill]

Quoting: Andy

Do you let all the idiot lights go out before cranking?

Yep.

Quoting: Andy

Could be the dreaded DMF!

If it is it's a recent thing.  I'll do a check this weekend.  Can't see why that'd affect warm starting though.