D Day for GM & Chrysler.

[F Body]

US carmakers General Motors and Chrysler must later submit their survival plans to the government, as part of the terms of their bail-outs.

They are set to detail their latest cost-cutting programmes in order to keep multi-billion government's loans.

No real surprises coming from GM ( I hope )

 Hummer , Saab & Saturn

With Chrysler sales falling nearly 70%, a poor model line up and Cerberus the owners flogging off the Jeep & Viper brands I can't see it surviving period

Should be on the news by 23:00pm UK time


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7893574.stm\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7893574.stm

[philoldsmobile]

its sad, but look at the dinosaurs chrysler in particular are producing... then look at what the more buoyant companies are producing - the era of the big car is gone, unless you are a prestige maker, so things like the charger and 300C are not going to lead them into the future, cool as they may be... simply because no one is buying them.

chrysler need to come up with a Fiat 500 / Alfa Mi-To / new  Ford Fester rival, and it has to be good, or its game over. sadly this wont happen, as the US press are already foaming over the mi-to and fiesta..

http://www.autoblog.com/tag/alfa+romeo+mi.to/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">http://www.autoblog.com/tag/alfa+romeo+mi.to/

[F Body]

Quoting: philoldsmobile

Alfa Mi-To

That was on 5th Gear last night and it looked OK, not cheap although ( you can enter the comp to win one for a £1.50 text )
Think it was about £15k

[philoldsmobile]

that must have been a top spec one (probably veloce), they start around £11k

the diesel kicks the fiestas arse on every count, emissions, economy acceleration and top speed.

[philoldsmobile]

from alfa website..
MiTo pricing
Code Basic Price Vat Retail Price OTR Charges Total OTR
1.4 16V Turismo 145.B31.0 £8,816.83 £1,322.53 £10,139.36 £605.64 £10,745.00
1.4 16V Lusso 145.E31.0 £9,512.49 £1,426.87 £10,939.36 £605.64 £11,545.00
1.4 16V Veloce 145.E31.0 £10,178.72 £1,526.81 £11,705.53 £605.64 £12,311.17
1.4 TB 120 bhp Turismo 145.B37.0 £9,838.30 £1,475.74 £11,314.04 £605.64 £11,919.68
1.4 TB 120 bhp Lusso 145.E37.0 £10,519.15 £1,577.87 £12,097.02 £605.64 £12,702.66
1.4 TB 120 bhp Veloce 145.E37.0 £11,200.00 £1,680.00 £12,880.00 £605.64 £13,485.64
1.4 TB 155 bhp Lusso 145.E35.0 £11,519.15 £1,727.87 £13,247.02 £630.64 £13,877.66
1.4 TB 155 bhp Veloce 145.E35.0 £12,273.36 £1,841.00 £14,114.36 £630.64 £14,745.00
1.3 JTDM Turismo 145.B30.0 £9,910.72 £1,486.61 £11,397.33 £520.64 £11,917.97
1.3 JTDM Lusso 145.E30.0 £10,591.57 £1,588.74 £12,180.31 £520.64 £12,700.95
1.3 JTDM Veloce 145.E30.0 £11,272.43 £1,690.86 £12,963.29 £520.64 £13,483.93
1.6 JTDM Lusso 145.E38.0 £11,370.21 £1,705.53 £13,075.74 £605.64 £13,681.38
1.6 JTDM Veloce 145.E38.0 £12,051.06 £1,807.66 £13,858.72 £605.64 £14,464.36

[art b]

just saw an article on look east, from gm luton, there used to be 30,000 people work there,

[F Body]

Quoting: art b

there used to be 30,000 people work there

In the 50's & 60's Vauxhall was Luton, there wasn't many things that didn't get made on site including all the engine parts, batteries & tyres

Nowdays we make a few of the larger body panels and everything else is bought in

[F Body]

Quoting: art b

just saw an article on look east,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7895211.stm\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7895211.stm

[HardRockCamaro]

Quoting: philoldsmobile

http://www.autoblog.com/tag/alfa+romeo+mi.to/

Ugliest car ever.  Seriously.

Prefer the Fiat.  (never thought I'd ever utter that sentence)


Still prefer the Ford, that new Fiesta is a real looker, thoroughly modern, like the Focus was when it first came out.  Ford might be getting their act together again...

While the fiesta won't hold its value very well, being a mass produced item, I doubt the Alfa will do much better (ironically the FIAT will probably be the most sense financially as it's the hot ticket style wise whereas the Alfa is like Marmite) unless they only sell a few making it a hot commodity amongst Alfa fans.



Back to the subject of Chrysler, I saw a shed load of 300C's in the US and plenty over here.  The big problem over here was availability, especially the diesel one.  You had to wait months and be prepared to pony up extra money.

[FUBAR]

[Fieldy]

Quoting: HardRockCamaro

Still prefer the Ford, that new Fiesta is a real looker, thoroughly modern, like the Focus was when it first came out. Ford might be getting their act together again...

i love it, have considered one myself over the last few weeks...

Good luck to GM

[F Body]

Well very little actual facts from GM

GM's Plan details a return to sustainable profitability in 24 months.

o Demonstrates GM's viability under conservative economic assumptions
o Expands and accelerates the Plan submitted on December 2
o Lowers the Company's breakeven to a U.S. market of 11.5-12.0M units annually

 GM is comprehensively transforming its business, globally
o Brands, nameplates and dealer networks streamlined and focused
o Productivity and flexibility gains enabling more facility consolidations
o Shared global vehicle architectures creating substantial cost savings
o Unprofitable foreign operations addressed

 GM's Plan emphasizes the Company's continued focus on great products
o ―Fewer, better‖ vehicles in U.S. supporting Chevrolet, Cadillac, Buick and GMC
o Renewed commitment to lead in fuel efficiency, hybrids, advanced propulsion
o All major U.S. introductions in 2009-2014 are high-mileage cars and crossovers

 GM's Plan calls for considerable sacrifice from all stakeholders
o Bondholders and other debtors
o Hourly and salaried employees, executives and retirees
o Dealers and suppliers
o Shareholders

I'll see if any more details are available, "IF" GM survives this period, it may well have done the company a lot of good

[F Body]

Quoting: F Body

I'll see if any more details are available

The GM Viability Plan also addresses the fate of HUMMER, Saturn and Saab.
The company says it expects to make a decision on whether to sell or phase out HUMMER by March 31.
GM has also requested support from the Swedish government before it sells Saab, otherwise the quirky brand will be forced to file for bankruptcy protection in Sweden by the end of this month if an agreement isn't reached.
As for Saturn, GM says it will phase out the brand at the end of its current life cycle, about three years from now. The only way Saturn might be saved is if its dealers or investors come up with a way to spin-off or sell it.

Going forward, GM will mainly focus on its core brands of Chevrolet, Cadillac, Buick and GMC, while Pontiac will become a niche brand with fewer models.

[Roadkill]

Quoting: F Body

GM will mainly focus on its core brands of Chevrolet, Cadillac, Buick and GMC

Right on.

It's a f*cking mess, though.

[Rob]

From AOL news page.....

General Motors and Chrysler's request for US government aid ballooned to a staggering 39 billion dollars (£27.4bn) -- only months after receiving billions in loans.
And the car makers revealed shocking new plans for massive job losses and intense restructuring to survive the deepening recession.
Vauxhall owner General Motors presented a survival plan that calls for a total of 47,000 job losses around the world and closing five more US factories - the largest workforce reduction announced by a US company in the economic meltdown.
Chrysler said it would axe 3,000 more jobs and stop producing three vehicles - the Dodge Aspen, Durango and Chrysler PT Cruiser.

The grim reports came as the United Auto Workers union said it had reached a tentative agreement with GM, Chrysler and Ford on contract changes. Concessions with the union and debt-holders were a condition of the government bailout.
GM said it could need up to 30 billion dollars (£21bn) from the Treasury Department, up from a previous estimate of 18 billion dollars (£12.7bn). That includes £9.4 billion the company has already received.
The world's largest car maker said it could run out of money by March without new funds and needed £1.4 billion next month and another £1.8 billion in April.
"We have a lot of work to do," GM chairman and chief executive Rick Wagoner said. "We're still going at this with a great sense of urgency."
GM's request includes a credit line of £5.3 billion to be used if the downturn is more pronounced than expected. But the firm claimed it could be profitable in two years and repay its loans by 2017.
The company looked into three bankruptcy scenarios, all of which would cost the government more than £21 billion, GM chief operating officer Fritz Henderson said. The worst scenario would cost 100 billion dollars (£70.4bn) because GM's revenue would drop severely, he said.

[philoldsmobile]

Quoting: HardRockCamaro

While the fiesta won't hold its value very well, being a mass produced item, I doubt the Alfa will do much better (ironically the FIAT will probably be the most sense financially as it's the hot ticket style wise whereas the Alfa is like Marmite) unless they only sell a few making it a hot commodity amongst Alfa fans.

little chance of that!! 10,000 already sold in italy, and even over here there is a waiting list till late spring to get one. (typically end of may) the latest crop of alfas hold their value very well, the 159 and brera especially - the brera is the 4th slowest depreciating car in the UK

the fiesta looks a little so-so to me, its just kinda meh....