Roadkill's 1983 Chevy Z28 - (Work Starts on Page 5)

[Titsy]

Cant remember which side you needed to replace... http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CHEVROLET-CAMARO-TURN-SIGNAL-92-91-90-89-88-85-LH-Z-28-/290552566129?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item43a6485171#ht_500wt_1156\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CHEVROLET-CAMARO-TURN-SIGNAL-92-91-90-89-88-85-LH-Z-28-/290552566129?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item43a6485171#ht_500wt_1156

[Roadkill]

Wrong year.  Mine's the early one.

Update - of sorts to follow - when I can be ar$ed to type it.

[Roadkill]

O.K.  So the plan this weekend (among others) was to start tracking down the oil leaks on the Z28's LT1.

I suspected head gaskets but feared a damaged block.

It definately appears that BOTH brand-new headgaskets aren't doing their job.

On the D/S there's a definate seeping of oil on the front of the block and on the P/S there appears to be an even vapour condensation at the base which is collecting to form another seep at the back of the block.



The block, itself appears fine.

The next question is why are both heads leaking ?

I'm taking no chances and removing both and having them both skimmed.  They'll then be re-fixed with new hardware and new gaskets throughout . . . if that doesn't work - fek knows !

On the plus sides from this I can find an accurate TBC for setting my timing (something, if you recall, is a near impossible on an originally non-keyed crank hubbed LT1).  Also I'll most-likely take the opportunity to throw in a new Camshaft (a baffling previous omission) and - while I'm at it - new lifters and chain, too.
With all the changes I'm also going to check the Push-Rod length (something that is utterly alien to me - so that'll be fun).

However.

That wasn't all the Camaro had instore for me this weekend.

I discovered I, as suspected, had an over-fueling problem as, in the process of originally trying to crank the motor, I discovered that No. 8 cylinder was FULL of petrol - hence my earlier concern of damage.

On emptying out the cylinder it was obvious I needed to check the regulator . . . . . When disconnecting the fuel line I found that there appeared to be a constant fuel pressure, dispite the pump being off . . . . long story short, the fuel tank had built up pressure (so the vent tube on the replacement tank is blocked, then).  On releasing the pressure via the cap the fuel stopped, allowing me to fit the pressure gauge.

It was only now I noticed the "tide-mark" caused by fuel forcing its way out of the fuel fittings and even out of the carb's gakets !!!

So, yeah, regulator's definately not right which was probably not helped by a constant pressure coming from 5 months of super unleaded building up gasses in the un-vented tank !!

Soooooo . . . . . Hook up the gauge and it's reading over 8 psi - rising to 9psi - too much for the carb to take (should be more like 5.5 - 6psi).

So we attempt to adjust it . . . . . and fail.

The regulator isn't playing ball so I take it apart and find . . . . . . . .
. . . . . nothing apparently wrong.

The spring does appear a little "stiff" so I proceed to give some tenderising between a block of wood and the road.

Put it back together and - hey, presto - now we're getting somewhere . . . . With some adjusting we get it settled at 4-5 psi - good enough for now.

I plan to replace the regulator-to-carb fuel line and fit the gauge permanently, now so an appropriate set of connections are on the shopping list.

This is where the work ended this weekend . . . a little disappointed as the heads have to come off and I ended with, I suppose, more problems than what I started with but hey-ho.

The good news is that the neighbours luuurrve the noise.

Honest.

[Andy]

Does the LT1 gaskets have a 'right' and 'wrong' way up? Were the heads torqued down in the right sequence to the right torque setting?

Could be worth running a compressing test to see which cylinders are leaking, that might give you a clue what to look for after removing the gasket.

Bit of a bum weekend with some positives then! Sounds like my one last week.

You've also reminded me to update our 'project' (I'm damned if it was sold as one!!)

[Roadkill]

Quoting: Andy

Does the LT1 gaskets have a 'right' and 'wrong' way up?

Yes and Yes I did.

Quoting: Andy

Were the heads torqued down in the right sequence to the right torque setting?

Yes and yes.

Quoting: Andy

Could be worth running a compressing test

Impossible without removing the headers completely.  (I'd prefer to just remove the heads !!!)

[Titsy]

Check the 'Braided Covered Flex Section' parts from the following link. Is this what you need to make up a new section of exhaust that doesn't bellow toxic smoke?

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/exhaustparts.htm\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">http://www.roadraceengineering.com/exhaustparts.htm

[Roadkill]

I think toxic's a bit harsh.

I like to call it "That new exhaust smell"

They are what is referred to over here as flexi-joints (typically used before cats') and yes, I know of them.

I didn't use them for three (edit) four reasons :

1) They're too short,
2) They're too thick (O/D)
3) They've got crappy steel ends (only the flex is S/Steel) and
4) They're not flexible enough for what I needed.

It's not a major concern . . . anything that smokes will eventually stop at some point . . . like all good fibreglass exhaust repairs - they smell for a bit.

If it continues to smoke I'll bang some 'glass in it.  Sorted.  

[FUBAR]

Quoting: Roadkill

the fuel tank had built up pressure.  On releasing the pressure via the cap the fuel stopped

On the IROC when I fill up @ the Petrol Station the petrol cap sometimes hisses with pressure release when i take it off... is that normal?

[Andy]

Quoting: FUBAR

On the IROC when I fill up @ the Petrol Station the petrol cap sometimes hisses with pressure release when i take it off... is that normal?

Get exactly the same on our RS, filled up at the weekend and had only done about 20 mins driving to the station. Got a lovely hiss as you unscrew it.

[Big Mouse]

New cam? are you going to buy one off the shelf or go for a grind? if you're thinking of giving it a little bit of sniff occasionally I'd take that into account now in your choice of cam.

A little extra exhaust will not make any discernible difference in day to day driving but it will wake that bad boy up when the gas starts flowing .

[Cunning Plan]

Quoting: FUBAR

On the IROC when I fill up @ the Petrol Station the petrol cap sometimes hisses with pressure release when i take it off... is that normal?

Yah I think so, my Mondeo even does it after a run or if very low on fuel. Think it is the electric fuel pump being powerful.

[FUBAR]

Quoting: Andy

Get exactly the same on our RS

Quoting: Cunning Plan

Yah I think so

Cool

Sorry, Hijack over

[Roadkill]

Quoting: Big Mouse

New cam?

Yeah.  I don't know why I never picked one up before . . . at $250 it's hardly a massive outlay compared to what I've spent !

Quoting: Big Mouse

off the shelf or go for a grind?

I can't pretend to know enough to go for a custom grind.  I'll admit my ignorance in this field.

Quoting: Big Mouse

if you're thinking of giving it a little bit of sniff occasionally I'd take that into account now in your choice of cam.

I was originally gonna go with the GMPP LT4 Hot Cam as a safe option as I know very little about the real world workings of Camshafts . . . .

However after some reading the Comp Cams 07-305-08 is very similar to the Hot Cam but comes in a choice of two LSA's being 112 and 114 . . . . The 114 has a smoother idle (not that I'm bothered about that) but is also - apparently - better suited for gas / blowers.

Here's a link :

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=390290446922&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"nofollow\">http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=390290446922&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

What's your thoughts ?

I was going to go bigger on the Cam but I'm not confident (enough) on the bottom-end to start constantly shifting at 6000+rpm in order to get the gains from a monster Cam.

On a sidenote I was toying with getting the heads worked on a bit seeing as they've got to come off . . . . any recommendations and ball-park figures on how much I'm likely to get reamed for this ???

Quoting: FUBAR

On the IROC when I fill up @ the Petrol Station the petrol cap sometimes hisses with pressure release when i take it off... is that normal?

There should be a filtered vent-to-atmosphere dangling under the tank AFAIK . . . . . . this should prevent pressure build-up.
There should be some pressure in the tank - but NOT excessive pressure.

[Big Mouse]

I know enough not to offer an opinion on what cam to go for other than gas needs a bit more exhaust, there are so many variables to take into account; bottom end, intake, carb, heads etc o get it right for your combo.

I'd speak to Pete Knight at Knight Racing Services in Daventry. His email is info@knightracingservices.co.uk

Nice bloke and he'll advise you sensibly. Other person to speak to is Dave... feck it, can't remember his name, Powell? but its Performance Unlimited in York, real nicefella and knowledgeable too

Both can sort out heads too although Dave has the workshop and CNC machines. He won't rip you off but that doesn't mean it won't be expensive although you're not going to need a lot doing for a little shot.

[Roadkill]

Have tried to email Pete but apparently it's not getting through.

[Roadkill]

Quoting: Big Mouse

I'd speak to Pete Knight at Knight Racing Services in Daventry.

Interesting.

Had no joy emailing Pete so gave him a call earlier.

He was generally helpful but, if I'm honest, would probably come across quite rude to some.

He commented that my choice of engine - the LT1 - was a mistake and that all except SBC, BBC, LS and SBF belonged "in the bin" which I thought was a tad ignorant given what some have done stateside.

It was also against the spirit true spirit of customising, too, to limit oneself - but -

He quoted £400 to skim / prep both heads (valves / guides) etc . . .

Then a further £800 for flow / port work.

(This works out at more then an off-the-shelf set so totally pointless)

He recommended an Edelbrock set instead.

I thanked him for his honesty and politely mentioned my Nos / cam situation.  I ventured that I was considering using the CC 305 and he replied along the lines of "that's generally the right idea".

I thanked him again and finished by asking if he would like to expand his knowledge and tackle a BB Caddy.

"No.  definately not".

"Well, thanks again . . . . ."

Interesting, albeit fairly non-productive.

[Cunning Plan]

Dissapointing when you get people like this.

In some way you think that they get people asking the same old questions to them over and over again, so if they don't know you as a friend then you can understand a short and rude reply.

On the other hand - I presume it is an interest for him - engines / vehicles in general. You would have thought he would like to discuss the options, especially IF there was some work in it for him - and even if there wasn't any work in it for him, either by choice or not, you are still a potential customer who has an opinion and goes away with an impression of his business. Just as you have done you have explained dissatisfaction with his reply, which would impact any one else's decision to offer him work.

I would have rather been polite so you go away with a good impression and become and ambassador for 'my brand'. Which you then go on through word-of-mouth and social media (forum) to tell others which increases my business.

I am currently buying some BIG purchases for my bus at the moment and emailing / calling asking questions is a huge part of the buying process, especailly when you aren't talking a fiver. For example, I am researching to get a custom-made wiring loom fabricated. The first guy I spoke to was just sending back one-liner replies - THAT IS NO GOOD TO ME WHEN SPENDING £375+! It does not give me confidence that after the purchase has been made I will get sufficient support if needed. I sell stickers with a maximum value of £4.59 - but I still try my best at replying to emails / answering questions

So, he didn't get my business - next company I spoke to has an email trail about 15 pages long at the moment - much better

Opps.

[Roadkill]

I agree.

The main surprise to me was that he just wasn't interested in venturing outside his safety zone.  This would strike me as a tad boring - limiting yourself to the same group of blocks day in / day out.

I'd have thought (wrongly) that engine builders would bite your hand off to get a bit of diversity once in a while.

(Edit - I recall speaking via email to a builder in New York regarding customising and building up a 390ci Caddy block and trans . . . . . . . His immediate response was "Wow, yeah, sure - did one of those about ten years ago - love doing the rare stuff" . . . . . I still have the email someplace.  Pity not all engine builders share that enthusiasm.)

To be honest I'll probably still get Pete (if he wants to, of course) to do the basic refurb work on the heads - he's fairly local so it makes sense in that respect.

As for the porting I simply can't justify a further £800 for that so I'll probably end up having a go myself.
Providing I don't go mad and break out somewhere it can only be better.

[Titsy]

If you are going to have a go yourself it might be worth doing it first so that if you feck it up you haven't wasted £400 on the referb. But i'm sure you already thought of this...

[Andy]

Quoting: Roadkill

I agree.

The main surprise to me was that he just wasn't interested in venturing outside his safety zone. This would strike me as a tad boring - limiting yourself to the same group of blocks day in / day out.

I'd have thought (wrongly) that engine builders would bite your hand off to get a bit of diversity once in a while.

(Edit - I recall speaking via email to a builder in New York regarding customising and building up a 390ci Caddy block and trans . . . . . . . His immediate response was "Wow, yeah, sure - did one of those about ten years ago - love doing the rare stuff" . . . . . I still have the email someplace. Pity not all engine builders share that enthusiasm.)

To be honest I'll probably still get Pete (if he wants to, of course) to do the basic refurb work on the heads - he's fairly local so it makes sense in that respect.

As for the porting I simply can't justify a further £800 for that so I'll probably end up having a go myself.
Providing I don't go mad and break out somewhere it can only be better.

While I agree with doing interesting jobs every so often, don't forget in the currently economy, taking on risky/over running/ or potentially futile jobs may not be in the best interest of a small engine builder.

At our shop we have had regular people/customers walk in with requests to do work as one offs. Simple ones ok, but ones that have no value aren't worth the time or effort in doing, the politest thing to do is turn them away.

Tis why i think to a certain level the world of labour charging in some businesses is backwards. For example a garage could have you car for a week, you pay a weeks worth of labour, but if you were asked to make something for someone and it took you a couple of days and you then asked for the labour, they would probably shit their pants.

Maybe its just me but I can understand why he probably said no if it's out of his comfort zone or area of expertise.

Regarding the other comments about wasting your time, that does just come across as a bit rude, but the only thing you can do is prove him wrong. Maybe he hasn't seen a decent LT1 block build yet

[Roadkill]

On a separate note . . . . . now I'm back working for a decent company it means I can get certain bits and bobs made up here and there.

So my new slam panel is currently being made - hope to have it next week . . . . . Should finish the engine bay area off nicely.

[ianjpage]

Quoting: Roadkill

So my new slam panel is currently being made - hope to have it next week . . . . . Should finish the engine bay area off nicely.

cool

[Roadkill]

Wow.

Another 2 months gone by.  Anyone'd think I'd been busy.

Major work pencilled in shortly, though.  That'll make me feel better.

[Roadkill]

Quoting: Roadkill on Aug 2

Major work pencilled in shortly, though

Yeah, that never happened.

Quoting: Roadkill on Aug 2

That'll make me feel better

That never happened, either.



Nevermind.

It's not over just yet.

[HardRockCamaro]

Just caught up with this thread...

Personally I wouldn't let a UK engine builder anywhere near a proper chevy build.  I totally agree with your comments re his attitude towards the LT1.  Plenty of fast cars running them in the US.

When I had the IROC I intended to import a built engine for the US.  They're more experienced, they're cheaper, and they have a better attitude on the whole.

If they have any free time on their hands you'd think in this economy they'd take almost anything on just to keep busy...  

It's why I hate dealing with UK companies, there's no "can do" attitude.